The headline of this post says it all.
See you there.
Monday, December 21, 2009
Meeting of Select Board will be at 7PM at the high school
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A political blog from Dartmouth, Massachusetts. I encourage debate of the issues facing our town on this blog.
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112 comments:
Build the turbines...but please Dr. Dippipo STAY COOL you kill the proponent position when you show your frustration. LOVE EM OR LOSE EM' its a good book on leadership
Watson, you must be kidding me? Where have you been? If you don't realize that all the i's have been dotted and t's crossed by now then you shouldn't be on the board. Your grandstanding is ridiculous. You haven't done your homework and neither have Stone and Dias.
Mr. Watson, Ms. Stone & Ms. Dias, after dragging this out week after week, are you really going to vote against this and not allow it to go to town meeting? I really don't think you will since the majority of the voters want this project to go through. Since there has been no real hard evidence that these turbines will be detrimental, this is the question Select Board members should be asking themselves. Will they let the representives of the people (town meeting) make the decision or not? The rest is just theatrics.
Thanks for doing your research Bill. One of the other three should have seconded your motion but they prefer to be drama queens.
What happened did they vote for the turbines ?
to 11:07pm -what scientific polling evidence to you have that the voters want this? I happen to agree with you but the meeting last night seemed to have been handled very well.
Handled well??? How many public hearings are there going to be to allow the same people to voice the same concerns? The Select Board needs to move forward with this and all this drama isn't helping. Bill was the only one to admit he has made up his mind even though the others have as well. The other three are trying desperately to convince the public that they are giving this careful consideration by dragging it out but they will vote yes. They would be foolish not to.
Bill is not a politician, he's way too honest. Just states his opinion and backs it up with facts from research. Stone & Watson are afraid to make a decision.What is calling people in Minnesota going to prove? You can talk to people in Hull who love the turbines and those who hate the turbines. People don't like change, plain and simple. What is in the best interest of the community?
I vote for the wind turbines.
The same things are being rehashed. People on both sides are losing their patience. All the data you need to make a decision has been put out there. If you weren't ready to make a decision yet, then you should have apologized for not having done your due diligence. I GUARANTEE that Stone, Watson and Dias will all vote yes on this. It would be just plain stupid not to. I agree, these delays are nothing more than dramatic grandstanding. Once again Bill is the only one who just puts it right out there without the insincere antics.
Bill
As it relates to your motion to allow the wind turbines to go forward, I congratulate you. Your consistency, as it pertains to difficult town issues, have illustrated leadership. In my opinion, your fellow board members are too political, to make the throat choking decisions they were elected to do. It's called politics.
Due to your determination to move Dartmouth in a new direction, you played an important roll in the appointment of a new town administrator, provided action to implement the P.A.Y.T. program, with out listening to all the back biting anonymous letters, you promoted several police officers, and now you are up from, none political, as it relates to wind turbines.
As it relates to my self imposed analyst of your town selectman leadership, allow me to be specifically clear, you are a physcal conservative, with a long hard left slant on social issues. I also respect your lack of tantrum, when confronted by malcontents. If you didn't have such a liberal social few, we could really get along.
Watson, Stone and Dias are playing games. They are trying to create the impression that they are giving this issue more thought than Trimble. What a laugher that is. Nobody on the board understands the project better than Trimble. Nobody on the board has done their homework better than Trimble. Nobody on the board has the courage to take a stand for the people of Dartmouth like Trimble. Even people who are not well informed about the project watching from their homes have a sixth sense for the B.S. that Watson was slinging last night.
This is what happens when you elect two "wet behind the ears" people to the SB. Add that to Ms. Dias and her political connections (the unions and the old "bar room" crowd). This is a real "no brainer". I will never vote for anyone who votes against this. I hope you all feel the same way. Why pay more taxes to keep the old energy sourcing?
I will stand on my head for ten minutes in front of town hall during rush hour if Stone, Dias, and Watson do not all vote yes on the wind turbine permit. These three are turning this into yet another select board dog and pony show.
The 500+ residents around the wind turbine site will be losing part of their bundle of rights. Shadow flicker is major problem on the residential property owners .The bundle of rights are made up of what are called "sticks" .
The Town of Dartmouth can pass a by-law to allow a special permit for commercial wind turbines . The problem now becomes how to compensate the residents who become the sacrificial lambs .A town by-law does not effectively weaken property rights as some may think .
You can see how the cozy ‘bundle of sticks’ works when society decides that the freedom to use your own property must be curtailed. After all, if you have a bundle of a hundred sticks and one is removed, you still have ninety-nine sticks . You must be compensated for the loss of that stick or any other additional sticks !
If Mr. Watson was so concerned about other sites and the effects on residents, why hasn't he done the research before now? He has known about the project and also about the residents' concerns for quite some time. Ms. Stone spoke to the EA in Hull for all of one hour. What does that prove? Thank you Mr. Trimble for thoroughly researching this project and proving once again that you are there ONLY to serve the public.
I also believe that the public comment portion of the hearing should have been closed last night. If Select Board members felt they wanted to hear more of the same from the residents, they could have made themselves available over the next couple of weeks on an individual basis. The Select Board could have taken this time to look into the issues and then come back for the vote. There isn't going to be any more information put forth that will change any one's mind at this point. The Select Board has more than covered it's obligation to hear from the proponents and opponents of this project. Stand up and make a decision instead of trying to make everyone believe you want to thoroughly investigate this project. If you haven't done so already, then shame on you. If you have, then have the integrity and character to say so.
Dartmouth has gone from a chairperson who could not control her bad behavior to a public who cannot control theirs. This is not the first time in the last few years that the Select Board has sat through personal insults, rude comments and interruptions from residents. Select Board members have shown patience and composure when confronted with these emotional and childish people. Residents are given the opportunity to speak their piece but do not want to allow those who they disagree with to do the same.
Of all the Select Board members, Nat Dias should be the expert on the turbines. She's been on the AEC for years! She should know this stuff inside and out!
Thank you to Bill for taking the time to learn and get needed information on this issue. Your statement was very informative. How long is the board going to entertain this group? I can't wait to see who they drag in to the Jan 4th meeting. Many people have spent long hours on this project. Let's take it to Town Meeting!
Isn't the public comment period closed?
As Attorneys Michaud and Savastano pointed out last night, there is a procedure for seeking an abatement if you feel that your property has not been valued properly in the tax assessment. The town is not a guarantor of the value of your property and a decrease in the value of your home is not a taking. As Town Counsel Savastano pointed out unless the value of the property is reduced to zero, zoning changes do not constitute a taking. The conflict between property rights of abutting owners is one of the oldest and most common issues before the courts. At what point does one owner's right to the free use of his land infringe upon his neighbor's right to the use and enjoyment of the adjoining property. That dispute is age old. In order to reduce these conflicts and codify the requirements, governments have resorted to zoning laws which restrict the allowed uses of real property in specified areas. Zoning laws may also specify property line setbacks, height limits and other restrictions as well. The goal in all these zoning regulations is to set out guidelines and prevent lawsuits by setting the rules in advance. Courts have upheld the right of governments to make this kind of rule. In making and applying such rules, there are many cases where a property owners land was devalued as a result of application of the zoning. The courts have held such devaluation is not a taking and that the property owner is not entitled to compensation for the reduced value as long as the zoning does not result in the property being worthless.
That person who wrote about the "bundle of sticks" sounds like a first-year law school student who slept through Property Law class. He or she is dead wrong. Bll Trimble's recent post on the subject is 100% accurate.
If Watson, Stone, and Dias take the comments of the anonymous bloggers here seriously, we are all in trouble. Remember, this was the Gilbert/Gracie blog. How'd that work out??
Michaud joined the other three yet escapes critism. Hmmmmmm????
to 4:25, Michaud, as chairman, cannot make or second a motion. I would bet three nickels that had he been able to, we wouldn't be having this conversation. Will you stand on YOUR head in front of town hall during rush hour if Watson, Stone and Dias all vote yes? Of course not, because Bill deserves the accolades that he is getting and the other three are drama queens that will all eventually vote in favor of this project. So, once again, get a clue. The chair cannot make motions.
I watched the meeting. Why does everyone need to repeat everything? Why does everyone need to repeat Why does everyone need to repeat everything? everything? Why does everyone need to repeat everything? Why does everyone need to repeat everything?
As far as the property rights issues go if the town passes a bylaw for the benifit of the town and some people suffer for the good of all -you should receive compensation.
The town has said they will shut down the turbines if they cause shadow flicker/storbic affect.
The residents around the turbine site would have to resort to a class action type of case to argue their loss of rights.
I found a website that explains alot about the commercial wind turbines. The material is very educational .
Paste this to your browser :
windaction.org
windaction.org
Good luck with your class action, pal.
The residents near the proposed site were well aware of the town's ownership of that land. They were also well aware of the town's right to use that land for whatever infrastructure reasons it deems appropriate. Perhaps we should put a new sewerage treatment plant there instead. Or the next landfill.
At least no one can complain that they didn't have the opportunity to speak out on this issue. I commend the SB for listening to over 6 hours of public comment and drivel. This is a huge project and certainly merits listening to those that wish to speak but in the end I think they will weigh the positives and negatives and vote to approve the special permit.
Good point. The SB has been patient and listened for over 6 hours.
The town spent five years trying to get the correct average wind speed at a height of 80 meters near the Waste Water Treatment Plant. The wind speeds of June,July and August using the extrapolation formula were just not there . The town had to use the Sodar method to gain those wind speeds for the summer months . There is no doubt if anyone looks at the calculated wind figures for June ,July and August at 80 meters there is a problem.
The town used a method called "adjustable engineering parameters". These are mean annual wind speed and its standard deviation and turbine performance characteristics. Engineers used a spreadsheet that performs the calculations.
After five years of planning the town made the decision in the past few months to raise the height of the monopole 20 meters to 100 meters .
You be the judge. Why the rush lets see how many agencies,schools and engineering firms are involved .Lets get all the facts together.
It may be a good idea to get a represntative from all the groups in one room,like the high school and have an answer and question session from town residents
www.windturbinesyndrome.com
We need to get the Vinalhaven videos into the hands of the residents and other town board members.
The AEC came to the 100 meter conclusion after the price of the 100 meter turbine fell 1 million dollars. So to compund it's benefit we save 1 million dollars off the cost and reap the rewards of 100 meter turbine.
Before the price fell on the 100 meter turbine I felt the cost/ benefit of the investment was not worth it, but once the town could save 1 million dollars just on the cost of the turbine,the economic benefit obviously became better.
Listen folks......their are those who don't want wind turbines and those who want wind turbines. The wind turbine committee can bring in engineers from Dartmouth too who in hell know where and those who don't want a wind turbine next to their property will come up with several known or unknown reasons why they don't want the turbines on or near their property.
Bill Trimble is the only none political person on the select board. He is totally committed for doing what is right for Dartmouth. He is a stand up guy.
Lara Stone is a nice person and she is trying too hard to do the unknown. Satisfy everyone. It ain't going to happen Lara. It's time to vote.
Mike Watson is another crowd pleaser. Mike, you got to stop listening to the people who don't want this wind turbine and vote for what is best for the town. You have the facts and certainly smart enough to figure out what you should do. If you truly believe this wind turbine is good for the town but bad for the people who live next to the chosen location, just VOTE. But Vote...
Nat Dias will get a pass on this issue. This is too much of a mental challenge.
Michaud is ready to vote. I commend him for allowing Nat, Lara, and Mike to do their political thing and play this out a little longer.
Mike is a good listener. His problem is listening to the wrong people. If you notice how Mike is always looking from left to right, I'd swear that some invisible person/ thing is whispering in his left ear and Mike turns to the right to speak.
The towns people are looking through a porthole, overlooking a sea of much needed money and our elected officials are listening to a few passengers who claim the money is not real.
Lets get an independent third party to come in. The town needs an aggressive, independent oversight as it is about to spend 9 million dollars . The engagement of an independent, outside consultant to review the results should resolve everyone's doubts. After 5 years I'm surprised the AEC didn't seek an independent third party .
We should expect that the public is poorly informed about wind power .They lack the knowledge about even prominent, long-standing issues. The longer the debate goes on the less chance this project will make it off the ground .
The knowledge of one is the knowledge of all !
Doesn't this play out like a union contract negotiation? Next thing, we will have our local version of the Gestapo lining the back walls trying to intimidate the SB. Some things in Dartmouth never change. Like trying to make progress.
Here it is in a nutshell .Lets ask Massachusetts Technology Collaborative (MTC) representative Nils Bolgen if the Dartmouth Waste Water Treatment Plant has the wind to support two commercial wind turbines at 80 Meters - Yes or No .
CONTACT
Program Manager, Nils Bolgen, 508.870.0312, ext. 402
All inquiries should be submitted to: Nils Bolgen, Program Manager: bolgen@masstech.org.
Does the Dartmouth Waste Water Treatment Plant have the wind speeds to justify two commercial wind turbines by the MTC standards ?
YES or NO
Although I am not an engineer or an expert on turbines, I do listen to those who are. I have followed this issue and have taken into consideration all the information that has been presented from both sides. It is an economically feasible project that will benefit the town and the environment.
I understand the concerns of the residents who live nearby and the emotional response from them. I have yet to hear evidence that confirms their fears. However, I do respect their right to those feelings and views. I have no doubt the financials will work so the question for me has become "would I want to live near turbines?" The answer is not only would I not mind living near them, I would love to have one on my property. I live in a very scenic area of Dartmouth and appreciate nature. I would not support any project that would take away from that. I don't feel that turbines do. If the numbers worked and the bylaws allowed it, I wouldn't think twice about having one constructed.
Marianne Walker, you could sell your current home and purchase one of the homes within 1300 feet of the turbines .
Lets see you put your money where your mouth is !
You could buy one of the homes as an investment !
If this is such a great deal the town could buy all these homes and sell them at a large profit after the turbines are installed !
Give me a break !
First point is that we are not proposing 80 m but 100m hub height towers. Second, we don't need to ask because there is already published data that tells us what to expect. Here is a link http://www.ceere.org/rerl/about_wind/RERL_Fact_Sheet_2_Community_Wind_Performance.pdf
We have data that shows the winds are about 6.3 m/s at the 100 m hub height.
If you put an industrial wind turbine 1000 feet behind my house, I am going to lose a lot, not just money. I will lose sleep. The project directly impacts health and safety and has financial impacts.
Is there full disclosure on health and safety issues or did selectmen rely only on the feasibility study conducted by the town’s consultants ?
If once the turbines are in operation, should the neighbors be adversely impacted, what's the process is for getting out of it. Is the town going to put money in escrow to buy our homes?
We need to set up a web site, go door to door and get residents along these streets involved.
The bottom line is that some people are seeing an opportunity to extort money from the town due to this turbine project. The town cannot give in to these people because it would open a can of "worms" that could include anyone who can see these things from their property. There is legislation pending regarding lawsuits to obstruct wind turbine projects which will increase filing fees and help eliminate frivolous claims. Let's hope it gets through the state house in a timely fashion.
These people are worried about wind turbines, but bought houses near a waste water treatment...aka SH*T plant and a very large sand and gravel company, with dust and trucks flying in and out of the area 8 months out of the year
There have been two open public hearings on the wind turbine permit. All parties were invited to and some did submit information regarding the health and safety aspects of wind turbines. That information is available at the Select Board office if you care to review it. Bottom line in my view is that the proposed installation meets or exceeds the requirements of the zoning bylaw.
I hope we don't return to the days of old when squeaky wheel minorities got whatever they wanted simply by crashing SB meetings. Three SB members, Dias, Watson and Stone certainly showed a lack of integrity and character on monday night.
There is some interesting information by Mr. Black on a couple of videos at this website that was suggested earlier. my suggestion is that ALL the SB members view these videos
www.windturbinesyndrome.com
Rowe, Mass., Nov. 28, 2009 -- Dr. Nina Pierpont, a pediatrician and population biologist in Malone, New York, has announced the publication of her book-length study: Wind Turbine Syndrome: A Report on a Natural Experiment. [1]In interviews with 10 families living 1,000-4,900 feet away from recently built industrial-size wind turbines, a "cluster" of symptoms was revealed: from sleep disturbance, which affected almost everyone, to headache to tinnitus, vertigo, nausea, irritability, memory and concentration problems, and panic episodes. Industrial wind turbines have a total height of 300-400 feet or more, with blades of 125-150 feet that sweep 1.5-2 acres of vertical airspace.
http://www.windturbinesyndrome.com/
All we're reading now are desperate last minute emotional appeals to preserve the status quo. The people on chase road have no facts so they are relying on non scientific studies on the internet and scare tactics. How sad.
You people continue to bury Stone, Dias, and Watson. MICHAUD VOTED AND AGREES WITH THEM. Maybe, just maybe, the four vote majority was the correct action.
It's the night before Christmas and all through the town, not a sound could be heard, not even a wind turbine
The selectmen were nestled inside with their snifter, in hopes of a morning without any flicker
My husband out of jail, and I not feeling well, had jumped into bed for a night of good sleep
When out on my lawn I heard such a clatter, I jumped from my bed to see whats the matter,
Away to the window I moved like a flash, threw out the shutters and fell on my ass, the moon shinning on the new falling snow, gave a luster to the new wind turbines that were standing in the ground,
When what to my wondering eye's should appear, but an old rusty sleigh with eight raggedy reindeer, I heard some old man shout, up Dancer, on Prancer, get over those blades, hurry up now or you'll lose your tail
Away to the roof top they staggered and fell, and I heard some come down my chimney like a bat out of hell, it staggered and stumble, fell down on the floor, stepped on my cat and broke down the door
I heard him exclaim as he rode out of sight, Merry Christmas to all and to all a good night.
To 3:35, One more time for the Sloooow guy. Michaud cannot make or second a motion because he chairs the committee. What you saw was Stone, Dias and Watson, who will all vote yes on this issue, hang their fellow board member out to dry. Trimble was the only member with the nads to make a motion which the others know they will follow, yet none of them had the integrity to second. Michaud would have seconded if he could because he is not a drama queen like the others. Trimble proved that he has the character to serve on the SB. The other three failed miserably.
I hope when the time finally comes, these three ladies will make sure that it is Trimble who makes the motion to approve this permit.
Stone, Dias and Watson showed a lack of resolve to act in the best interest of the community and that's what's just too bad.
To 4:52- I think your slow. I UNDERSTAND the chair cannot make a motion. I get it that Trimble's motion could only be seconded by Stone, Dias, or Watson. When that failed Einstein, a motion was made to discuss at next meeting.
HERE IS THE RESULT OF THAT MOTION. Watch again if you must.
YES- Stone, Watson, Dias, AND MICHAUD
NO- Trimble
You call me slow- Which side do you think Michaud was on? Or do you beleive the chair cannot vote on motions as well.
I can't wait for your response!!!
Dr. Nina Pierpoint is not a serious researcher. Her work was not even published in a science journal. Her husband published it!
Of course there are risks with everything, but they are rare, while the turbines in Dartmouth are a big plus. There are turbines in downtown Boston!
You will see more and more turbines in the state and the country. We need to develop alternative sources of energy. We have been so lucky in Darmouth to have such dedicated and intelligent people associated with this project. Bill Trimble educated himself on risks and benefits of the turbines. He showed great leadership at the meeting the other night. I only wish our other board members could make a decision instead of continuing to listen to the same group over and over again. Or perhaps they will bus people from Hull, Mass Maritime, or Portsmouth who are against the turbines. The Select Board gives a permit only. It is the town meeting that will decide.
Michaud only made that vote because the issue was decided already by the DRAMA QUEENS. All of which will vote yes on this issue. It must be hard for you to accept that Trimble is the true leader on this issue. Especially since you would like it to be your issue. You proved that by joining the AEC after all the work had already been done. Trying to ride on Dr. D's coattails while your favorite candidates lack the guts to face a vocal minority who cannot produce anything of substance that would support a no vote on this permit. You'll probably be supporting Dias in the next election since the two of you were hugging at intermission. We'll see how that goes for you.
How do you know why Michaud voted the way he did??
Extend the same to all four members who voted in favor or none at all. In case you don't know, there is no such thing as a psychic. You couldn't possibly be in Michaud's head.
Trimble's speech at the end was hardly leadership.
My observations of Trimble's leadership on this issue are that of a bystander. I'm sure that it was just as obvious to many others. Stone, Dias and Watson showed cowardice at the moment of truth. Not the kind of people you want to be in a foxhole with.
This whole project boils down to this project being stuufed down the throats of the Dartmouth residents.
The University of Massachusetts is in Dartmouth.
The Massachusetts Technology Collaborative a semi quasi state agency that falls under the umbrella of UMass.
The Renewable Energy Research Laboratory (RERL) at the University of Massachusetts at Amherst exists to promote education and research in renewable energy technologies also falls under the the umbrella of UMass.
The Massachusetts Technology Collaborative pays the University of Massachusetts engineering students to do wind studies.
Chairman of the Massachusetts Democratic Party, also commented on the significance of the Dartmouth project .
The Alternative Energy Committee (AEC), chaired by Dr. Ron DiPippo Joined the UMass Dartmouth faculty in 1967; retired June 2004 and now also a wind turbine consultant .
Peter D. Friedman , Department of Mechanical Engineering, University of Massachusetts Dartmouth ,A wind turbine case study performed for the Town of Dartmouth, Massachusetts illustrating and provided adjustable engineering parameters .
The agenda here is to place a commercial wind turbine in a residentially zoned neighborhood ! There is too much outside influence from state agencies !
Frankie boy , You forgort one --- The University of Massachusetts Dartmouth wants to put a big wind turbine on their campus .
The permit process just happens to go through the Town of Dartmouth .
So one hand washes the other . Its Massachusetts .
Wind turbines so close to resident areas is dangerious. But don't believe me, listen to the residents of Vinalhaven, Maine from Dec 19, 2009:
http://www.youtube.com/watch?v=jtGijb_oNeQ and http://www.youtube.com/watch?v=Bw4S98SYHiE
The decision to built this project should be fact based and not fantasy. Dr. DiPippo, despite his title, is showing remarkable ignorance -- or bias -- it's hard to tell. No matter, he is performing a disservice to the people of Dartmouth.
Vinalhaven Celebrates Community Wind Power Project (hundreds in attendance)
http://www.youtube.com/watch?v=a3EVPPr2A40
It was better to go to keyword and Google :
utube Vinalhaven Maine wind turbine
" People in the South need to be concerned with the issues in the North, and people in the North need to be concerned with the issues of the South. There are lots of "projects" that get forced on all residents of this town. But it's always a select group that gets its way at the expense of us "little people."
All of Dartmouth needs to take interest in all of these projects, then stand up and support your fellow resident. Whether they live in the North or the South, it shouldn't matter. Because the next time, it will be in your area, and one of these select groups will try to ram something down your throat."
It's Christmas eve folks. For most of us, this is the holiest time of year. Political debate is a good thing but can we have a truce for a couple of days here? Let's embrace the spirit of the true meaning of Christmas. I extend my wishes for all to have a peaceful, joyous holiday.
TIME FOR A "DARTMOUTH TEA PARTY "
Its time to open a present for Christmas,a can of political corruption and call it the "Dartmouth Tea Party " . I am only going to use initials in this blog for fear of reprisals . Here we go - There is a large Boston law firm that represents the interest of commercial land based wind turbine contractors (Aka renewable energy ) .That firm is F H LLP - Lawyers . They manipulate the Massachusetts Energy & Telecommunications Committee .
Many of the town attorneys know or have in the past worked for this firm . There are many state representatives that have worked or have associations with this firm . The newspapers won't touch this but are well aware of the representations made by this firm . The attorneys from this firm have actually made public appearances at town meetings on the SouthCoast in favor of commercial wind turbines representing an investment firm called PC and the contractors . This firm is the driving force behind commercial land based wind turbines . They do not care about residential property rights - These attorneys represent the millions in commissions, legal fees and representation of a renewable energy goal in Massachusetts that is a get rich quick scheme just like the Massachusetts Big Dig !
The residents of Dartmouth need to wake up ! We are paying for orange trash bags to throw out our garbage, the libraries are only open part time and the street lights are out ! The Dartmouth Select Board wants to borrow millions of dollars to start a commercial wind turbine plant ? These SB members talk to you like children ! We can borrow millions on bond issues like you never have to pay it back ? Look at the big picture how much longer can this kind of operation go on in Massachusetts - Lets close the lid on the cookie jar !
Stupid/stupid North Dartmouth people.
Where were you when the South enders ( TMM ) decided at a special 1993 meeting to approve a regional landfill DUMP, to be located off of Quantapoque Road, in North Dartmouth. Where were you when the South enders decided to approve an energy plant off of Energy Road in North Dartmouth. Where were yo when the South enders decided to put a county jail along Faunce Corner Road in North Dartmouth. Where were you when the South enders decided at town meeting to rezone the land area along Route six and Hixville Road, to include all business.
It's time for all good North enders, men/women, to come to the aid of their South enders and put an end to this wind turbine procrastination, and demand that the wind turbines be erected in the intended location along Chase Road,in South Dartmouth. This area selection rejection, is just what it is. For the first time the South enders may get the stick rather than being the sticker. I live in South Dartmouth and I say stick the wind turbines in the ground along Chase Road. I hope the South enders along Smith Neck Road can see the flicker and twirl of the rotating blades that will be saving MONEY for all of our town, including the North enders. Anyone who feels this is not a town location issue, is stupid.
As it relates to Bob Medeiros sand pit operation, allow me to offer some further information. Medeiros bought the property long before homes began to spring up in the and along the Chase Road location. Within a short time, the new home owners began complaining to the selectmen that his business was operating to early, making too much noise,truck drivers were slamming the tail gates that make a loud bang when dumping.
How can any selectmen object to this quiet, out of the way project that will be a money saver/maker for all people in Dartmouth.
Beware the turbines. Watch as people become transfixed and zombie like with shadow flicker syndrome. Only to be carted away on hand trucks to the local shadow flicker de-tox center. Adjacent properties, formerly the jewel of Dartmouth, some with lots of nearly 1/3 of an acre take on the appearance of being abandoned. Overgrown landscapes and dilapidated dwellings smear the formerly pristine area. Vinyl siding and portable garages fall into disrepair. Ah the menace of the turbines!
These people that complain live next to a WASTWATER treatment plant....do you see hypocisy here....I DO!!! They bought the house AFTER the sh*t plant was built...they knew it was there...and they stil bought it...PUT UP THE TURBINES NOW....thank you BILL for having a backbone.
We may not all agree, but I want to wish all a wonderful holiday season and a very happy new year!
7:37- Happy Holidays. But you are as naive as the anti-wind people. You must have voted against Stone and Watson. To be critical of them and give Michaud a pass for voting the exact same way is as indefensible.
I urge everyone that reads this post to look at Vinalhaven Maine and the problems they have had with wind turbines. Keyword Vinalhaven Maine check out the videos .
The representations made to the residents of Dartmouth leave out any and all negative information.
Remember its not what's in the studies done for Dartmouth it's what's left out !
Once people get over the sight of the turbines they will appreciate how much in terms of revenue this will mean for the WHOLE town. The landfill and energy park benefit the whole town just as the turbines will benefit us all.
The TriLateral Commission along with black helicopters, UFOs, and some dusky people, who may be Muslim immigrants, are conspiring with people who have education and expertise to force our town to save money, strengthen our nation, and save the planet. Don't be convinced by the evidence! Oppose this insidious plot.
Mass Maritime, Hull, Portsmouth and Portsmouth Abbey have already fallen prey to this terrible plot to kill our children by placing wind turbines right next to their schools. The fools!
Luckily we have people who know the facts (but can't disclose them. Reprisals, you know) and can expose the Islamofascistcommie plot. They're trying to kill us in our beds, what more proof do you need! Get out the torches and pitchforks. The flag! Motherhood! Apple pie! Moderation in the defense of property value is no virtue!
What if all the wind wizards are frauds, whether they knew it or not, and their magic turned out to be no more than a collection of cheap stage tricks. Above all, the key promise of financial stability —that it would make the financial system of Dartmouth more robust by spreading risk more widely—turned out to be a lie.
You have believed in renewable energy. I have, too. After all, I am an intelligent person, as you are. The diabolical thing about renewable energy—any energy source, for that matter—is that it comes with baggage. Sometimes huge & scary baggage. The AEC forgot to check the baggage in on this trip . Where is the baggage ?
With the expenditures of nine million dollars someone will make a name for himself by tackling white-collar crime and investigating fellow politicians.
Turbines catch on fire!!!! oh wait so do the houses around them....what opponents dont understand is they live next to a wastewater treatment plant...why weren't they concerned about airborne stuff then?
Of course Trimble is in favor of the turbines, he can't even SEE them from HIS house. Come to think of it, neither can anyone else on the AEC or the SB. What a miraculous coincidence!
So much for a Christmas truce!!!
A.As wind turbines spread, local opposition to the massive towers (some over 400 ft tall) is appearing. Residents not only oppose the turbines for aesthetic reasons, they also worry how wind turbines will impact property values. Local residents often object to wind turbines because they make noise, have a strobe affect with the sun and have large airplane warning night lights. These questions have not been asked of local residents in national surveys as you have been led to believe by local officials .
B.In the simple equation of municipal budgets , if the property values go down on properties near the site, then more of the tax burden will fall on the rest of the ratepayers whose homes may not even be in range of sight or sound.
C.Wind turbine proponents including some public officials typically label local opposition as Nimby ("not in my backyard") responses and attempt to dismiss it.
We are not trying to unreasonably stop wind development. We are in favor alternative energy and saving the planet . But we will not benefit from wind energy development if in the process our homes and community are destroyed.
Bill, how many times are you going to allow the same few people to say the same few things over and over and over again? Reading this blog is getting as bad as suffering through those Select Board hearings.
Stop the madness. Vote.
frank1, Your homes and community being "destroyed"? Please, give us a break.
Sounds like you have some baggage alright! What the hell are you talking about? Do you want the lights to come on when you flip the switch? I think you do. There are tens of thousands of wind turbines all over the world providing power to people. How do you think they work, magic? wizardry? Almost all the energy we use, including fossil fuel, has come from the energy of the sun. So does wind. The difference is we won't run out of wind and we will run out of fossil fuel.
What if reality were an elaborate program and we were actually stored in pods and connected to a huge computer? Neo-o-o-o!
How much will the town be paying back on the 7 million dollar bond and the internal revenue service bond of 2 million ?
What is the total yearly bill to pay back the 9 million in bonding ? How many years ? What is the approximate cost per taxpayer over the life of the bond ?
Does the town have a site to review the funding ?
BRUSSELS (AP) — The United States now leads the world in wind power after boosting wind energy capacity by half last year, the Global Wind Energy Council says.
The U.S. overtook Germany by building windmills that can generate 25 gigawatts of energy, about a fifth of all global wind power, it said Monday.
Surging interest in renewable energy and worries about climate change propelled a 29% increase in wind power generation capacity across the world last year — and fueled a wind turbine industry that was worth $47.5 billion in 2008, the council said.
http://www.usatoday.com/money/industries/energy/environment/2009-02-03-%20wind%20energy_N.htm
As it relates to intellect, or people who claim to be intelligent. It's people who make such claim, that caused the understanding of nuclear fusion, fission, and the horrific nuclear bomb, that one day could destroy this world.
As it relates to the benefit of a nuclear power plant, don't expect to see any construction in the near future. In France, nuclear power provides 80% of all electrical power.
We can not seem to come to terms with a stupid wind turbine, for a clean cheap energy, that will provide the town with electrical power. This turbine(s) will allow the town to become independent from oil producing nation that are killing our military fighters, hate our way of life, and threaten to kill us all. Not only should we erect the turbines, I'd like to see if the town can offer, or establish an off shore facility/ refinery for oil.
How stupid of me. I'm not intelligent. I wouldn't know or understand the first or last thing about oil or nuclear plants. It's only the smart intellectual people, who know what is best for me, and everyone reading this post.
Nope, I ain't a smart person. But I can attach, if I had one, a nuclear device onto a 155 howitzer shell and fire it into the sky. Where did I get my smarts? I'm one of uncle Sam's best, I'm a Marine. We fought, and we died, like so many other people so that some of you so called intellectual people can provide us with the weapons to kill.
Now, this wind turbine isn't going to kill you or anyone else. It is simply a nice clean way of creating energy you you and me. Don't get so upset about the flickers or the shadows they are not a cause of concern. Don't be so upset if your property valuation goes down, it's not the end of the world. I'm sure you can be compensated by the town or just let me know and I'll point one of those howitzers at the town hall on a Monday night. Just kidding folks don't be calling the FBI. Just be happy that you are living in a nice quiet town and know that the smart, intellectual people, are in full control of everything.
Stupid me, can some one explain how the wind blades are going to turn if the wind is not blowing?? Maybe we can hire some not so smart people can turn the blades by hand.
Maybe the town should build a nuclear plant ?
the winds blows 80-90% of the time at 100Meter.
I can only hope that Watson, Stone and Dias are happy that they have prolonged this vote. They should be forced to read this blog in its entirety every two hours until they admit that they are going to vote yes anyway!!!! Thanks for the extra week of fighting over something that the three of you know will be a unanimous approval.
On a loan of $9,000,000.00, the intial cost of the turbines with an interest rate of 5% for 30 years, the Town of Dartmouth payment is $48,313.95 per month .At the end of your term, you will have paid $9,000,000.00 in principal and $8,393,020.59 in interest for a total payment of $17,393,020.59.
SHOW ME THE SAVINGS - SHOW ME THE MONEY
You can go to :
http://www.myamortizationchart.com/
The correct figures are 2 million with no interest and 7 million at 4% for 15 years
The payments would be around $60,000 per month for 15 years .
That's 60 thousand a month
The 800K the town saves initially is NET savings...after all expenses of the investment. Rumors are rampant in this town....build the turbines now!
The $800k number is a 50% probability. The 99% probability number is----drum roll please---$376k Both numbers represent
NET FINANCIAL BENEFIT = ELECTRICITY SAVINGS + SALES OF EXCESS GENERATION + SALES OF RECs – DEBT SERVICE
STOP THE TURBINES
The formula for Dartmouth is based on twenty years with a perfect record of warranty. You can easily find wind turbine contractors in California that went out of business over the last twenty years because of no warranties after 5 years .
There are a many parts of a wind turbine that are prone to failure. One is the blades themselves. The blades are subject to constant exposure to wind stress. This can cause a blade to weaken and fail over time.The bearings on a wind turbine however are given a definite life span and if you buy a turbine you should plan for them to be replaced.One shortcoming it has, especially in comparison to other sources of power is that wind turbines are prone to breaking. The narcel has a set of brakes and over 1000 moving parts.
AAER is a perfect example of a company with no extended warranty .A lot of second-tier manufacturers struggle to sell their equipment because they don’t offer an extended warranty.The Town of Dartmouth used this company as a model .
Am I mistaken, or will the development of the turbines be bid out?
Frank1 - why have'nt yo shown up at any of the hearings?
The Town of Dartmouth will post a Request for Proposal , RFP , similar to an AAER 1.65 MW turbine .
The designer selection law, M.G.L. c. 7, §§38A½-O ("Designer Selection Law"), requires Dartmouth to adopt written designer selection procedures, which must be used when contracting for design services for any building construction, reconstruction, alteration, remodeling or repair project that has an estimated construction cost of more than $100,000 and an estimated design fee of $10,000 or more. The wind turbines are an addition to the waste water treatment plant.
For any municipal design or construction project that includes funding provided by the Commonwealth, in whole or in part (such as reimbursements, grants and the like), cities and towns must incorporate minority-owned business enterprise and women-owned business enterprise participation goals. If applicable, the Awarding Authority shall take steps to assure that it complies with all State Office of Minority and Women Business Assistance requirements.
Dartmouth Community Wind Project 06/15/2004 -
--------------------------------------------------------------------------------
Awardee: UMass - Amherst
Location: Dartmouth
Technology/ies: Wind Energy
Project Type(s): Community Wind Project
Program & Initiative: Clean Energy Program/Community Wind Collaborative
Total Funding Amount: $4,289.71
Project Overview:
The Town of Dartmouth is working with MTC to explore the feasibility of developing a wind turbine project on municipally-owned land. In October 2004, the UMass Renewable Energy Research Laboratory (RERL) conducted a Preliminary Site Analysis at locations chosen by the municipality to determine an appropriate site to explore feasibility. RERL installed a meteorological (MET) tower adjacent to the Dartmouth Water Treatment Facility site selected by the town and collected wind data from March 2005 through July 2006. The Town is now working with MTC as part of a broader research effort to characterize the wind resources at heights up to 100 meters in south coastal communities of Massachusetts.
Does anyone find it odd that the Masasachusetts Technology Colaborative which is located at the University of Massachusetts ,Amherst awarded $4,289.71 to the University of Massachusetts ,Amherst for the wind study for the Town of Dartmouth in 2004 ? Also in 2004 the 100 meter height was mentioned in the report . What the heck ?
It's XMAS guys- get a life and enjoy the holiday. Anonymous blogging isn't what's great about this time of year.
Christmas is a good time to enlist the help of the Massachusetts Bar Association in selecting an independent attorney to perform a third-party review of facts,figures and studies done for the Dartmouth wind project .
Lets get full disclosure .......
The last post must be an attorney. They think they're experts in everything. Most aren't even very expert in the law. Go figure.
An independent attorney to perform a third-party review of facts will follow the paper trail that leads to jail .
Who really knows about confusion , misrepresentation ,omissions and false assumptions unless we get a third party to review the whole project .
What an absolute joke!
Folks ,
This is not a joke !
You all need to look at the source of documentation and just exactly who are these experts ? The state,towns and cities are allowing wind turbines to locate near homes and neighborhoods, it is knowingly endangering the health and well-being of residents
We will soon see if the SB ignores the ample evidence on the turbine/bad-health connection and is choosing to turn a blind eye to the suffering caused by the AEC siting decisions. The Europeans have already experimented with turbines and have setbacks that average around 2500 feet . The European setbacks have been ignored in Massachusetts. The cities and towns of Massachusetts have been handed a plate of facts and documentation made in Massachusetts for Massachusetts --not a history of facts worldwide ......
Does Massachusetts have to large of a coastal population to accommodate wind turbines? The wind resources on land are better the closer you get to the coast ,the only problem over the past fifty or so years coastal properties,towns and cities have been the most sought after for vacation and tourism . Aka - the towns can't afford to buy your property to get the proper setbacks so it's easier to introduce by-laws that simply take your property rights . These by-laws are sold to towns as some have to suffer for the good of all ,divide and conquer and pick a location in your town where people won't fight back !!!
The Europeans have been in the win turbine business much longer than the US . Lets take Denmark where Vestas makes some of the best wind turbine in the world ,the setbacks are six times ,6X , the height of the turbines to habitation
These two turbines must be placed at a sufficient distance from homes to ensure no harm is done to nearby residents. But since the AEC or the Town of Dartmouth refuses to do its job, those who care about this issue will be obliged to use the federal courts.
Everyone must want clean energy, just not in my back yard. The selectmen, except Bill Trimble, are playing the political card. Watson is so political it makes me sick. I voted for this wing nut, because he stated he will vote on issues that best serve our town. He just didn't say how long it will take.
Here is a challenge to Mike Watson. I dare you to vote NO. If you lived in the turbine location, you'd be voting no.
Lara Stone is a crowd pleaser. She doesn't want the anti turbine people to be upset with her. Lara will vote yes on the turbines, but not before she fully and completely proves that she has listen to each complaint and concern. Her action is similar to that of the executioner. How can I save these people with turbine concerns, and throw the yes switch at the same time. Be careful for what you wish for, Lara. You just might be elected.
Nat Dias will vote No.
Joe Michaud will vote Yes.
Trimble makes the motion for the turbines, second by Lara Stone. Dias and Watson vote no. Michaud votes yes.
If you have been to Western Europe, you frequently see these things. We have successful local installations, as well. The bottom line is the self-serving factor. I hear peple wanting to extort money from the town because of the proposed location. I hear people making claims that it will shorten their lives and ruin their health. I hear lies about the cost and revenue estimates. I hear Watson and Stone making idiots out of themselves playing political cards. And it is all about making a choice to substantially lower energy costs in the town. And that is truly all it is. This process has made my top 10 list of the most pathetic episodes in Dartmouth history.
THE UNIVERSITY OF MASSACHUSETTS DID AN ICE THROW STUDY FOR THE TOWN OF COHASETT . WHERE IS THE ICE STUDY FOR DARTMOUTH >????????????????????????
ICE THROW:
Richard Tabaczynski, Atlantic Design Group: Presented ice throw probability study (UMASS Study on ice
Throw) prepared by Renewable Energy Research Laboratory (RERL). Full Ice Throw Report was submitted to
Planning Board Office today. John Modzelewski did not have time to review report.
• One study initially cited 1.5 X the height of the turbine + the blade diameter as the “risk area” but then
went on to say that there have not been any instances beyond 100 meters. Atlantic Design looked at about an
800' area for this filing’s risk area potential.
• Ice falls predominantly downward of the rotor plane
• Ice fragments more often tend to shed off blade tips
• Large pieces tend to fragment in flight
• Fragments have been observed to be < 1 Kg (2.2 lbs)
• Threshold distance exists outside which there is no significant risk from ice throw. The threshold is relatively
independent of the turbine size and configuration
• Within this threshold distance, the risk can be evaluated with suitable assumptions of ice shredding frequency
and fragment size. Member Ivimey asked what would be defined as “significant risk” - Tabaczynski
responded that definition of “allowable risk” is typically left up to Boards to define in terms of, for example,
the comparison to chances of being hit by lightening. The worst case ice throw case they found was 140
meters while other studies indicated ice throw had not been found beyond 100 meters
UMASS recommendations included:
• Curtailing turbine operation during periods of icing
• Manual start-up following icing situations after confirmation that ice has melted
• Control of site access
Cohasset is characterized as a “light” icing environment - meaning that icing occurs for ≤ 1 day/year (based on
NOAA Norfolk County data and reports for past 8 years taken at Bluer Hills Observatory which is 600' elevation
and, probably worse weather than Cohasset experiences).
http://www.townofcohasset.org/planning/minutes/040809PLANNINGBOARDMEET.pdf
The turbines are not a joke, this blog is a joke. Just another excuse for malcontents to throw stones at the select board.
The turbine studies have been going on for several years now. What's the problem with waiting one more week? Pathetic.
Thank you Stone, Dias and Watson! The longer we can delay this thing, the more we can fight and divide the townspeople. Your divisiveness can only help our cause.
Anon - you're the divisive one. And by the way you left out Michaud. But you knew that I am sure.
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